Epic Bill

He built 13 video rental stores, brushed up against pop culture history, then watched streaming wipe out an entire era. Instead of letting that loss define him, Bill “Epic Bill” Bradley turns reinvention into a sport and then chooses the most unforgiving arenas he can find to prove one point: you can keep going even when the odds say you shouldn’t.

We talk through the entrepreneurial origin story, including the rejection from banks and the scrappy credit-card strategy that got his first store open. Then we follow the pivot into sobriety, running, and extreme endurance, from Badwater 135 to the escalation of double Badwater and a jaw-dropping quadruple crossing of Death Valley. Along the way, Bill shares what failure actually feels like up close: underestimating the Grand Canyon, getting pushed off course in the English Channel, and coming within 600 feet of Aconcagua’s summit before his body shuts down in the thin air.

The heart of the conversation is mindset. Bill explains why he chases what scares him, how he uses mantras like “I’m doing the best I can do, and the best I can do is good enough,” and why “chunking” a giant goal into small milestones keeps him moving. If you’re searching for resilience, mental toughness, ultrarunning motivation, or a real-world blueprint for not quitting, this one delivers. Subscribe, share this with a friend who needs a push, and leave a review with the goal you’re ready to take back.

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Shoutout to:

Epic Bill Bradley 

The Bradley Family 

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Raising Awareness:

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Transcript

Meeting Epic Bill

SPEAKER_00 0:27

Bill Bradley, how are you?

SPEAKER_01 0:30

I am doing excellent, man. How are you doing? Miles and Mountains Power.

SPEAKER_00 0:36

Do you go by Epic or just Bill?

SPEAKER_01 0:41

I usually go by Bill with my friends, and that's you. But hey, Miles and Mountains Power again. Woo.

SPEAKER_00 0:51

But I'm pretty sure at the end of this episode, I'll be calling you Epic Bill because your story is quite epic. What you do is epic, is outstanding. And yeah, it's one of I've I've interviewed a lot of athletes, endurance athletes, people on this podcast, but nobody mounts to you and your man, your resume. So let shall we get started? Yes. Okay. Not only are you you go by epic bill, you you're an extreme endurance athlete and a motive motivation speaker. All right. Epic Bill documentary. Gonna just just let's put that out there. So 57 minutes. I feel it could have been longer. But like you said before, to make it to go to PDBS, you had to be under an hour. I get it. I get it. But you're you're before the movie, you were a self-made man. Sounds like almost like a mafia guy. Self-made men, right? You owned you owned video rental stores, not blockbuster, not Hollywood video, but Bradley videos, correct? Correct. And this is what they started with uh at the documentary. The the coolest thing about that was you were in a movie movie, too. It was in Scream One, which which really was which put everything in perspective because I mean not only were you in it, but your sister was in it, correct? You guys were the uh cashiers.

SPEAKER_01 2:38

I wasn't in the movie. I let those who my employees at the time were in the movie. Okay, all right. I was two of my my people, and they were in the movie, and they yeah, they loved it. It was a big deal, man. It was a big deal to everybody. I mean, so then I was more of a behind. Yeah, well, at the time we had no idea what it was, and by the way, they went to Blockbuster first and Hollywood first because the big names, yeah, and they turned them down because they didn't want to be in a horror movie, and we said, We don't care about being in a horror movie, we'll take anything we can get, right? And my and they love being in it, we had no idea it would be as big as it got, you know. We thought it was just gonna be some B-rated horror movie, but it was you know, really took off.

SPEAKER_00 3:24

Yeah, it was it. It was the start of this the biggest slasher series or you know, movies of all time almost, you know. I mean, they're on what seven? I'm pretty sure they're gonna get eight, you know, but scream.

SPEAKER_01 3:37

So to put things in perspective, they brought they had our they brought our shirts back in, just so you know. On the last one, I think they had our shirts back on the employees or something. I don't know. They start they were they're selling our Bradley video shirts were being sold online, like somebody was copying the design we had and selling it online.

SPEAKER_00 3:57

Yeah, well, it was a huge moment in the movie. It was a huge uh moment in the movie because Jamie Kennedy was discussing what not to do in the horror flicks, right? That was

Video Stores And A Scream Moment

SPEAKER_00 4:10

the scene and and Jamie Kennedy has character Randy Meeks is a huge horror buff, right? And he just explains hey, this is what you do, this is what you don't do. If you do this, you're gonna end up dying. If you do this, you end up dying, you know, and it's all that right there. But I was all like, oh my gosh, this is so weird. You know, this is so awesome and weird at the same time, just because you know, it's it's a little glimpse. But me as a scream slasher buff myself, I was like, Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_01 4:42

So movies, I can tell you know, you really know that movie, you know, very good, very important. I couldn't believe I don't even I didn't really watch horror movies, and I go, I can't believe we're in a horror movie. Yeah, but oh my goodness, so I had to go down and watch it, but it's it's you know, it's more of a little bit more humor in it than yeah, in you know, most horror movies, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:06

Like Jason and Freddie, yeah, oh yeah, yeah, yeah. So you had your your movie place, right? You had multiple, obviously, correct?

SPEAKER_01 5:19

How many store up to 13 at the end?

SPEAKER_00 5:21

13 at the end, 13 stores. Okay, and then things were good, streaming came along, you you lose it, you lose them all. Not you don't lose it, but you lose them all, right? Because of streaming. I bet you I bet you now people would appreciate the stores. I know I missed it, I've missed it since day one. I didn't think the streaming service was or is good. I I feel like Red Box is was trashed, that didn't last long, you know what I mean? And so it's like, okay, I wish the stores did come back.

SPEAKER_01 5:55

But the story I think they made a mistake putting us out, just so you know. I'm gonna stick up for the video stores because if they would have kept the window with us, we would still be in business. Oh, yeah, and that was a really good revenue stream for the studios. And Netflix, you know, is now competes with them. Yeah, so they not only wiped us out by taking that window out, but then they compete. And then when you really look at Netflix, they they were $6.99 or $9.99 for a month. Now they're up to $26.99 once we got wiped out.

SPEAKER_02 6:31

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:33

So not as cheap as what they put us out with.

SPEAKER_00 6:37

No, so what made you at the time when you were I'm a sore loser if you if you can't tell? No, you're not, you know, you're a winner, but what made you no, no, yeah. What made you think of getting your own movie uh stores? What what had you do it? Were you a movie buff? I mean, did you feel like you know there was a lot of money in it at the time? What?

SPEAKER_01 7:03

I think it was more of a move movie buff. I'm just a I'm a guy who goes after his passion for sure. Yeah, I mean, I don't want to just do a business to do a business, you know. And I was I was working for my dad at the time as an electrician, and the fur and my dad had started his store, you know, I was like one of his, I think I was his first employee, and grew it into like a multi, multi-million dollar business, you know. Yeah, and he started with you know five thousand dollars in the bank and and he had four kids. And so, you know, I was kind of in the same situation, you know, and I was working for him as an electrician, but I had bigger things on my, you know, always had bigger goals. Yeah.

The Scrappy Funding Strategy

SPEAKER_01 7:50

And they opened a video store in town, and me and my mom, my mom's passed away now from you know from cancer, but she was we used to go to movies all the time, man. And she was a big fan, and it was a big bond we had, you know. And and so when they opened that up, it was like, you know, I just I really thought it was great, the first video store, little dinky thing, you know, in town. Yeah. And I go, wow, this is great. I wonder if I could do one of these, you know. And I literally went around and studied like all the little video stores and and you know, and and kind of figured it out how to do it and and went to go borrow money, and it was like 50 grand back then to do a store. And I could take, I had a house already. I was like 22, you're maybe 23, 22, and I already had a house, and so I knew I could borrow off that house and get half the money, and then the other half, I kept asking people how to borrow money. And you know, I remember I went in to get a small business loan or whatever, you know, went into the three banks in a row, and they just didn't want anything to do with lending me money, you know what I mean? And then the third one I remember the guy didn't even show up. He was uh he he he was like just left me, stood me up. He went to lunch, and I'm like, you know, and I'm like 23, you know, and I'm like, wow, I I don't I don't think these guys want my business, you know. I mean, I'm I'm not a a fool, you know, these guys don't want my business. So, but you know, when you have a passion, you keep trying, right? So I kept asking about how to get money, how to get money, how to get money. And my my my ex-wife had asked, told somebody at work about what we were trying to do at the time, you know, and she said, her friend said, he should talk to my friend Kenny, my husband Kenny, because Kenny was a used car loan guy. And I don't know how they are now, but they were really creative back in the day. They were known for being really creative. And so I go, Oh, he sounds exactly who I need to talk to. A used car loan guy. And so I went in there and we talked. And he goes, Bill, this is what you do. Do you have any credit cards, Bill? I said, Oh, yeah, I got one. He says, Well, this is what you do. You go to downtown San Francisco, you pull a credit card from every bank that you could find, you fill them all in, fill them all out, and then you mail them all in at one time. And that's exactly what we did by credit cards, and we got like 15 credit cards back, and we charge the second half of the store. Never quit, always keep pushing till you figure out the answer, man. And it worked out to your advantage. It will it worked. We got we got the store, then we then we got we paid the credit cards off, and then we charged them up and opened another store. So I didn't I didn't go to a regular bank and get a regular bank loan for uh probably like five years or something, you know, because it was so hard to get a business loan, you know.

SPEAKER_00 11:07

Yeah, so credit cards. That's what it said in the documentary. All right.

SPEAKER_01 11:13

Then streaming gets to be harder nowadays.

SPEAKER_00 11:16

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. So so you you did that, you're successful, and then all all of a sudden streaming came in, destroyed the whole business, and not not your business, but just the the the feel, the the actual you know, face-to-face, going to the movie store, video industry, yeah. Video industry, yes, yes, that everybody loved to go to Friday, Saturday night. Me always went Monday through Sunday just because I loved movies. I loved movies until it was streaming. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So God, I love that. Oh, yeah. So, and then when you lost that, you ever watch about Quentin?

SPEAKER_01 11:59

Just real quick about Quentin Tarantino and how he got started. He worked in a video store and he just watched tons and tons of movies, yeah. And that's how he got his start and eventually went to Hollywood and went for it, you know. But he was a big, just a big movie lover and worked as a just a regular guy in a video store. Oh, yeah, yeah.

Streaming Ends The Video Era

SPEAKER_01 12:20

A lot of people are like that, you know. Look at him now. Oh, I know.

SPEAKER_02 12:23

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:24

I know that we loved we had so many people that were movie buffs that would rent from us, right?

SPEAKER_00 12:30

So you you lose that, right? And then all of a sudden you you pick up ultra running. Now, did you run any time before you just picking it up?

SPEAKER_01 12:44

Yeah, so I spent my 20s developing the business, but I was also drinking, I was the drinker. I mean, you know, I was a partier, whatever you want to call it. So that was in my my 18, you know, up to in my 20s. And so I would party and and I was and I was, you know, they're always at I couldn't believe I'd go to these video conventions and the studios were making tons of money back then from us. You know what I mean? Nobody was getting a cut of the money yet. They hadn't figured out how much the video was making the studios, and then the actors and everybody started charging more. But in the beginning, we were like the king, the kings. You go to this like five or six-day convention, all these big giant parties, you know, celebrities showing up, free food, free booze. I love the free booze back then. You know, just I thought I was in heaven, and then everybody you talk to wants to hear about video. And you're like, oh my god, I drove everybody nuts at my in you know, we're at my home and everybody. But here, people really want to listen and and hear. And so I literally thought I was in heaven back then, but I I did learn from the video stores, I mean, from going to those conventions about you know, just about business. And we just started you know, meeting people and and and and and started like doubling

Quitting Drinking And Running Again

SPEAKER_01 14:10

our business like rapidly.

SPEAKER_00 14:11

Yeah. So but then you you're a drinker, but when did you start running? Because that's because when you lost Oh, yeah, sorry, I got off track. No, no, when you lost it. I got off track.

SPEAKER_01 14:22

So at 30 at 30, at 30, I we were still going strong in the video, but I was tired of drinking, man. It was getting me in more trouble than it was fun anymore. I didn't enjoy it. Yeah, and it was like I remember I went to a function and I said I'm only gonna have a couple, and then I got hammered, and I woke up in the morning and I said, I'm more than this, and I looked in the mirror and I said, you know, this is enough. I'm quitting right now because I've said I've got bigger plans in life than being a drunk, you know, whatever. I was just more of a social drinker, yeah. But three or four times a week I socially drank. Yeah, I I hear you, I hear you. And then so I went to AA, I went to AA that I went to AA that day, yeah, and and literally I and oh let me fix it. A year before I'd gone to a Tony Robbins seminar, and it was the first time I'd gone to a four-day Tony Robbins and I went I was sober for four days in a row. The first time in a decade that I'd had a good time when being sober, and I literally after that, I went out and started running. I because I it brought back how I liked track in high school and everything and went back to running. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:42

How many miles did you run that day?

SPEAKER_01 15:47

I think I went out and ran 10 miles, if you can believe that, just because I was so pumped by Tony Robbins. He had me like all his visuals and this. I couldn't even do that, I couldn't even do that now. But back then he had me like flying on a kite. I mean, I was so high from his experience that I went out there and I think I I joined a running club that I didn't even know. You know, he gets you a word of you two out of your comfort zone, and then I went down with his running club and ran 10 miles, and I never even ran in like years. But I had been biking them, so I wasn't cross-training.

SPEAKER_00 16:24

Okay, cross-training, but also were you hurting after that? Were you hurting bad? But it had me going. I had the bug then. All right, I had the bug, I had the bug. You you had the bug, did you run the next day? Did you run the next day? Probably not.

SPEAKER_01 16:45

But if I rode two days after that, yeah, I was probably too. I don't remember, but it yeah, I was I'm sure I was really beat up after that. Okay, so so you think I had blisters and all kinds of stuff, man.

SPEAKER_00 16:57

Yeah, yeah, I could imagine 10 miles right off the bat. I mean, I could see a 5k or five mile tops, but you go 10 miles, all right.

SPEAKER_01 17:05

10 miles, and I was with like runners that were real runners, yeah. And they're and I'm like just like freaking staying up with them because I'm doing all the Tony Robbins mental toughness stuff. Like I just walked on hot poles, I could

Badwater And Grand Canyon Limits

SPEAKER_01 17:20

stay with these guys.

SPEAKER_00 17:23

So that gives us in the segue of I mean, what you've all done. I mean, the you know, the documentary speaks for itself. You guys, if you if you haven't, please watch it. It's Epic Bill, it's a documentary. You can watch it on Prime. That's where I watched it. You can rent it and everything else. But some some of the things, you know, what you said, you started off with the 10 mile, 10 mile, right? But then when you watch Epic Bill, you'll know who we're dealing with. I know who I'm talking to right now. Epic Bill, Badwater of 135. How many times, Bill? I've done the race.

SPEAKER_01 18:00

So I've done the race twice, right? When it was a 135-mile race, and then I'm this guy who's like, All right, I've made that twice. I need the next challenge, right? Yes, and so then I'd heard they have a double bad water, right? So I went out there, and and with the double bad water, you do the 135 miles and you go up Mount Whitney and you go all the way back to the start. And so I did so I did the double bad water, and I'm one of 23 people who ever did that at the time. Yeah, and then I go, then I hear that some people are even doing a quadruple bad water, right? Yeah, and so I went out and did four times across Death Valley in August, 110 to 112 degrees, with two Mount Whitney summits, 584 miles, and two Mount Whitney summits. And you find out what you're made of when you do that. Let me tell you.

SPEAKER_00 19:01

You're gonna keep finishing what I'm about to put down, all right. All right, Grand Canyon world record, most consecutive rim to rim to rim runs.

SPEAKER_01 19:11

You still have the I had heard, yeah, I I don't have it anymore. Somebody finally broke it. I held it for eight years, but I had heard about people doing rim to rim, you know, runs, and then the most I'd ever heard was people somebody had done, they'd done four, and so I did a lot of research. I called all because I wanted to set a world record to to get myself on the map so people would listen to me, you know what I mean? And so if you have a world record, people are gonna go like that because gonna get some attention, you know. Yeah, and so I I looked up and I I called all the running clubs, and nobody knew of anybody who had done more than four crossings, right? So I said, Well, I'm gonna go for five crossings, right? And and then then the then and I and I made a big announcement about it, right? You know, like I did a press release, I learned a lesson on this, just so you know, that I'm gonna do five, and then like the week before I was supposed to do it, somebody went out there and did six.

SPEAKER_03 20:19

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:21

So they broke my record before I ever had a chance to set it.

SPEAKER_00 20:25

In this world, you keep everything, you keep everything together. Like, keep it to yourself, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:30

Yep, yeah, you don't put it out there like that, you know. And then, and then, so then he did the guy did six, and I said, Well, then we're gonna go out there and do seven, right? And I went out like the weekend before and had or two weeks before, and then I go, I'm gonna go do a double, right? You know, and and I think this was before the guy did the seven. This is before, so this is me doing my, you know, getting some experience there in in Grand Canyon. And I kept saying, Well, I've done it, I had done a double bad water at that time, and so I went out there and I took the I took a plane in and like a red eye, and I just went straight out to the Grand Canyon, and I go, Well, this will be like I'll gotta get used to be sleep deprived and all this, and so I'm just I'm I'm gonna go do a double Grand Canyon, you know, sleep deprived. Like I took a red eye out there and just went right to the start line, and I go, it can't be as bad as a double badwater, right? You know, and I went down that canyon and I start going across, and it's killing me, right? I mean, I really underestimated it, really underestimated it. Yeah, and then I go up that north rim and I barely make it to the top, and now it's like really cold. I'm so I was so confident that I would make it that I really didn't bring any cold weather, you know, any like. Sleeping bag, nothing to sleep, nothing. And there's a whole hotel up there on the north rim, right? So I go up to this ho, so I go into the hotel and I go, Hey, I was gonna do a rim to rim to rim, and and I don't think I'm gonna make it back. Can I get a room here? And they go, We're full. So now I'm sitting up on this rim, it's freezing outside. Yeah, I'm totally exhausted. Yeah, I go out in the lobby and I sit out in the lobby. I don't even know what I'm gonna do. You know, they're looking at me like they're gonna kick me out, you know. Yeah, and and then the guy goes that a hotel room opened up and I got a and I got a chance to sleep. And I've been so wiped out, I was gonna take the shuttle back to the start because I with my tail between my legs, because I got I got wiped out on one crossing. And here I was gonna do, you know, seven. And so I anyway, but I got up in the morning, I said, Man, I better make it back. So I ran, I I ran it back, you know, even though I was hurting really bad. And then I said, Wow, I now know what I'm dealing with with that canyon. Yeah, and so I went in with a much like you know, like I said, maybe a month later, I went in with a much more mentally strong and knew what I was dealing with, right? And I made seven of them. I was mentally prepared for what that can be. It was tough.

SPEAKER_00 23:27

Heck yeah, so much elevation. Seven.

SPEAKER_01 23:33

Yeah, 42,000 feet of climbing. And then at the bottom, it was like a hundred to one hundred and ten degrees

English Channel And Denali Reality

SPEAKER_01 23:40

on the bottom. It was it was late May.

SPEAKER_00 23:42

Yeah. Crazy. All right. So you you've done that. You swam the English channel. How many times? I swam 20 20 miles in the English channel.

SPEAKER_01 23:55

20 miles. I tried five. I got separated on my fifth attempt. I they put up a science at four miles to go. I was I could see shore. This is my fifth attempt. I go, I know I got it this time because I never quit. I got it, I can see the shore. And then a big cloud came overhead, and this big storm started hitting me. And it was like I just put my head down and just go, I'm not quitting till I make this. And I swam for an hour in this storm, and I wasn't even looking for my boat. You know, I was just like so focused on trying to make progress towards land. And then I looked up, I couldn't know. Before I looked up, then they put up, they put, then they put up a sign up for an hour that said seven miles to go. I go, you gotta be kidding me. I got pushed back three miles when I'm swimming. I go, that's impossible. So my brain's just going crazy up there trying to figure all this out. And then and what had happened, just so you know, was that storm was keeping me in place, and and I just went sideways and you're supposed to hit this collis point in in France, you know. And if you miss that point, then you go, you gotta go way in to hit land, you know. Yeah, and I missed that point. But when I was when I was digging the second time, I mean, after the after the guy, after they put up that seven-mile thing, I said, I'm really I'm not gonna quit, I'm just gonna dig. And then I looked up and the boat was gone, man. I've been swimming for a while. I couldn't find I'm I'm looking around like it was literally like the perfect storm because you're in like an ocean. I mean, there's huge freaking waves everywhere. And I'm looking around like in the movie The Perfect Storm when the boat went down and he's out there treading water in a big storm, and you're going like, and I'm going like, oh, this is not good. I can't find the boat, and I'm out here in these white caps treading. And then I finally seen the boat about 100 yards towards England, you know. Swam to it, and the guy he just said, I can't, I can't stay with you in this storm, Bill. And and so I gotta call it, you know. And then it was funny because I gotta tell you this part. We started, there was another guy started at the same time as me. We were on two separate boats, and we we swim to shore to start, you know, and he's he jumped in, he was jumping at the same time I was to swim to shore and start. And and he uh he looked looks at me and he goes, Hey mate, I'll see you in the drink, mate. And I said, and I go, Yeah, I'll see you in the drink. He was from Australia, you know. So we swim to shore and we both put our hands up and they blow, you know. My guy, my guy blows a whistle to start, and his guy blows a whistle, and he takes off and he's like a lightning ball. He's a super elite swimmer, right? He just he just left me in the dust. I go, Well, we didn't see each other in the drink very long, mate. And so where this comes up again was that at the end, you know, when when I could when I'm sitting in this storm and we're starting to head back to England, the guy hands me a bucket, right? He goes, I go, oh no, I have a patch, I don't get seasick, I have this patch. He goes, No, Bill, you just hold on to that bucket, right? And so, sure enough, I'm so exhausted, so wiped out that the patch doesn't even work. I start puking in this bucket, and then I hear over the radio that the guy from Australia made it to shore. And I said, How did that guy from Australia make it to shore? With this storm, he said he was so fast that he got protected by the cliffs and he was able to make it to shore. So he made it to shore, and because I was slow, I got the consolation prize, which was a bucket in a two-hour ride back to England puking in his bucket after an 11-hour swim. It was like being tortured on top of tortured.

SPEAKER_00 27:54

All right, Denali, how many times?

SPEAKER_01 28:00

Six attempts. Six. And it I've made it up to high camp. Yeah, I've I've fallen in a crevice. A couple times I've fallen in crevice. Once I fell down 25 feet, that's the scariest man. That's the scary thing. There was a I know. I'm I'm roped to somebody, so you kind of fall like Spider-Man.

SPEAKER_02 28:20

Yep.

SPEAKER_01 28:20

You know, you're not, you're, you're dragging the whole team with you because I was the la the last guy on the team, and I broke through and and went down. And I remember I'm sitting there and I'm like, help looking up at the little hole up there, you know. And then I look next to me, and there's a gloved hand sticking out of the wall. Like solo climbers will climb that and they just disappear. Oh, yeah. You never they never hear from them again. Oh, yeah. And so there's a gloved hand sticking out of the wall. I'm like, oh, hurry up and save me. But it was like, yeah, I got that. And then I've had I've had frostbite up there so bad, my thumb turned black. We were we were stuck in because I've taken like six attempts, yeah. But one time we were stuck in this camp uh at 10,000 feet for eight days. It snowed eight feet and eight days. Every day I kept dumping. It's like one of the snowiest parts on on Denali. Yeah. And and so, but when it finally cleared up a little bit, the guy goes, Do you want to go for the next camp? And we're all like, Hell yeah, we do. We're sick of this place. I couldn't stand looking up at this tent anymore. And so we we go, we get this little little window and we start heading up. And after two or three hours, we get hammered with a blizzard, just hammered, like minus 20, white out. And so we had to retreat back to that camp and reset up our camp and everything. And I I was just, I was, I was working hard. I got a you know, uh, uh just my liner glove on, you know, and I was like, and uh, you know, and you're trying to get the 10 up because you want to get out of this blizzard, yeah. And uh anyway, I ended up with frostbite, man, like really bad frostbite. And I I had to go down because of that frostbite, you know, but it it it like took like six weeks to heal up. And I had to go to three doctors up there until one told me I was gonna keep my thumb. You know, the first two were like, I don't know, it looks pretty bad.

SPEAKER_00 30:24

It turned black, you know. Yeah, yeah. When it turns black, anyway, but I never quit. Yeah, yeah. So the the the mentality though, the mental state when when it's blizzard, right? Eight feet of snow, you're basically honkered in a tent. How how many days were you honkered in? Or how long were you honkered in?

SPEAKER_01 30:44

Eight days, eight days at 10,000 feet. So and every day you have to get out and shovel. What did you do?

SPEAKER_00 30:51

Shovel all the snow around your tent for eight days outside of shoveling. Like, what else did you do to keep your mind at home? Because that has to be the hardest part, just being in the tent for the guy.

SPEAKER_01 31:05

The guy, the guy had brought the my room tent mate, or one of my tent mates, had brought a kindle up there. Oh, okay. And he just he read like 10 books or something, right? I didn't bring anything up there. I just stared at the fucking roof of the tent.

SPEAKER_00 31:21

That that has to be tough.

SPEAKER_01 31:22

I mean, yeah, your mental state mentally tougher, it breaks you, man. I don't know. I I just you know, they did we did have have a we did have a mess tent, kind of whatever you call that. Yes where we'd all go and eat. And so you could go back and forth to that tent and you would see people there for a while, then people would go back to their tent. So you did have that, and there were meals, you know, which kind of I think that's what kept me sane. Oh, okay. You know, more than you know, you weren't just sitting there in your tent staring up at the ceiling, and you did have to dig, and we would work on skilled work, you know, like they were smart about that. Yeah, they say we're gonna work on this for the next climb, you know, whatever, some sort of skill technique we would work on too. Okay, but yeah, a lot of staring at the top of the tent. A lot.

SPEAKER_02 32:11

Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_01 32:12

But quit reading over there.

SPEAKER_00 32:14

Right, gotcha.

SPEAKER_01 32:16

All right, my tent mate.

SPEAKER_00 32:17

I'm not I'm not gonna say the name because I don't want to murder it or slaughter it, but you've done Argentina's high point. You've how many attempts?

SPEAKER_01 32:27

Uh I think I've had three attempts at Aguincagua. Yeah, Agoncagua. Aconcagua. Yeah, yeah. So I've had three attempts at that. The one I think you're talking about, the movie was my first attempt where I did my best. And and I and the reason I climbed it is because I was so I was I I was tired of not making Denali. And so I said, Well, Aguoncagua is higher than Denali. It's the highest mountain in the Western Hemisphere. It's not as technical as Denali, right? You're not on big ice and cliffs and all this stuff and crevices, and but it's really high, and because it's so high, people do die up there, you know. Oh, yeah. And so I thought, well, you know, I I so I went down there and we we went out uh, you know, with with this guided group, and there was like 12 of us, and and I liked it. It was just a just a big hike, basically. Yeah, and you have quarters down there, so you don't have these big heavy packs like on Denali. Denali, I at one point, I think I was uh it's like a 40-pound pack and a 65-pound, or it was like 115 pounds total between my pack and my my sled that I was dragging up that mountain. Yeah. Aguankaboy, you got a little pack, and we got quarters. And oh, this is so much easier. But then you get up to like the last day. Now you're up really high, and the last day you climb like 2,000 feet, I believe, to the to the summit. And that's where all 12 of us have made it that far. And then we got up to uh, I don't know, I guess we're we were 600 feet from the top, and six people had dropped, or five people had dropped. I guess six. And then it was like there was like seven of us left, or whatever, six of us left. And uh in at this last camp, and he said, you know, and they're all dropping because it's really hard to breathe up there now. Yeah, you know what I mean. You're up at you're up at 20, 20, yeah, 21,000 feet. And uh, and so he we took a break, and I remember we went to stand up to go to the to to head up for our last you know, big push to the top, two hours away from the top, 600 feet. And I stood up and I I couldn't even stand. I just I had to sit back down, man. I was so weak. Yeah, and then I and then my my tent mate up there, he stood up at the same time, and he also sat back down. Remember, I laid on my back, I'm just grasping for air, I couldn't even breathe. 22,000 feet and almost like panicking, yeah, almost like panicking, 22,200 feet. Woohoo! Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then then he goes, All right, I'm I'm counting down to five, four, three, two, one, and you gotta get up and go, or you gotta go down. And so my my tent mate, he had been like he'd been in like this position on the ground, you know, with his arms up like the prayer position, and he was laying on the ground, and and I was laying on my back grasping for air, and and he was able to get up and and and and walk and fit made it to the top. And and I asked him what he was doing then, and he said that he was praying that he could make it to the summit. I go, I need to do that next time. Because what happened when I stood up, I just like I I started walking and just fell over. And then I go, like, well, I'll just crawl. It you're so weak and so I couldn't even crawl. Yeah, I couldn't even crawl. And that's that's when I filmed that one. I pulled the GoPro out and filmed the one you saw in the movie with all the I mean white stuff coming out of my mouth and all kinds of things.

SPEAKER_00 36:13

But it explained the emotion, though. It showed the emotion, the pure emotion on how much you wanted, how much you've you you've dealt with in life. And and and it was a it was it was a pivotal moment, and and I felt it, and that's what I wanted to say, man. It really showed the true emotion of Epic Bill. And so okay.

SPEAKER_01 36:34

That's that's I think I wanted to make that thing so damn bad. I know for sure I was gonna make it. I thought for sure I was gonna make it, and it was gonna be a confidence builder, and it was a step towards the Nale, which would be a step towards Everest, which is my long-term goal, and and then to not to fail so close to the top, like you, and it was like you I felt strong the whole way, yeah. Till then I remember my my my uh my guide on the on the last half of the last climb. He's like, Bill, you're starting to swerve. And I go, Well, what does that mean? He goes, I don't know. I just want to let you know you're starting to swerve. So, really, what starts happening is you get so depleted in the oxygen that you're almost like drunk up there. Yeah, so I'm swerving on the trail, you know, and so he's just kind of letting you know you're probably not gonna make it because you're already having trouble, you know what I mean? You're having trouble with the oxygen. So that's his way of kind of letting you know you're not gonna make it because there was no solution. It was okay, I'll walk straight and then you start swerving again.

SPEAKER_02 37:43

Yeah, I left.

SPEAKER_01 37:45

But yeah, I was devastated by that not finishing that. Devastating, but like you said, I came with a thing that maybe my calling is not that I have to make these things. Maybe my calling is that I don't I just keep trying and I don't quit, and and I'll go out and I'll take anything on, pretty much anything, right? And and and I'll just do the best I can. And I may or may not make it, but if I don't make it, at least I'm in the arena fighting

Arrowhead 135 And Survival Lessons

SPEAKER_01 38:20

the fight and trying as hard as I can try.

SPEAKER_00 38:22

And and that's what the audience saw and felt all in one. So another la I've I've left this on the last one because it I I've thought of it arrowhead 135. That's your your bread and butter, but it's like your nemesis. Why why arrowhead 135? Why? And so many times, too.

SPEAKER_01 38:49

I think because I'd gone up, I I'd gone up to Alaska and I did the Susitna 100 up there, and I'd made that. I was six hours after the cutoff, but I'd made that, and it was like minus five degrees. But all these guys up in Alaska were talking about Arrowhead, you know, guys in the race. Yeah, that if you really want a challenging race, you you've got to go do arrowhead, but you you've you'll never have felt cold like what you feel out there, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 39:22

And where are you from again? Washington state. Where do you live? Eastern Washington.

SPEAKER_01 39:28

Well, you know a little bit. We live in the city. You gotta get some snow up there, don't you?

SPEAKER_00 39:32

Yeah, but I live in the desert eastern. So, yeah, eastern part of it.

SPEAKER_01 39:36

Okay, you don't get it. Okay, yeah, but anyway, so he said, like, this minus five up here is not good training for arrowhead. You need to go to survival camp to learn how to survive in arrowhead's temperatures. So I remember I went to the survival camp in you know for like it was like a four-day or something. Really don't remember that much that I learned other than you need to get in your sleeping bag while you still can. Yeah, because when you get really cold, you start shaking so bad from hypothermia that you can't open your sleeping bag, and that's how you die. You die right laying next to your sleeping bag because you can't get it all open. Yeah, and I remember so I go to Arrowhead after I made, and it took me two tries to make Sicitna, but I made it like six hours after the cutoff up there, which was a huge deal to me just that I made it because that was blizzard conditions, also is very tough. Yeah, and when I did Arrowhead, I remember that I got up there and they had no cutoffs the first year I did it, right? And I'm going up there and it's minus 35. And I had never felt cold like that. My hands were frozen as I'm walking up the trail because I I said, How come my hands are freezing? I bought the best gloves in in Santa Rosa's REI, which I'm in, you know, warm California. The part that's warm, warmer anyway, and and their gloves weren't that cold red, you know, and so my hands were almost like numb. I couldn't open, I got to where I couldn't open my sled, so I just kept going. And when I when I made it to the first checkpoint, oh yeah, when I made it to the first checkpoint, I remember I I like had to go in and warm my hands on there. It was like a popcorn machine or something. I had to stick my hands in there and warm them to get some heat back in there. But I had never felt cold like that. And and everybody dropped who was around me at that point. And the guy goes, he goes, Bill, I go, I'm going out. I go, I I always go. And he goes, No, nobody's ever made it who left this late. You know, I go, well, I'm gonna be the first, right? Yeah, so I went out by myself, it's freezing. Now I got hand warmers at least, you know. I I got some hand warmers in my gloves, and I went out and I basically by the time I got to the second checkpoint where I told it was it was like a restaurant, a little cafe out there. I was told it was the checkpoint. This wasn't as organized as it is now. This was you know 13, 14 years ago. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was just starting, but anyway, the restaurant, the cafe was closed. And so I was freezing, I was exhausted, I was freezing. I was probably at what the cutoff is now. I was probably six hours after the cutoff, what it is now for the 72-mile checkpoint. I think it's in the afternoon sometime, and I was in the in the night, and uh, and I'm not and I knock on the cafe door and I'm like, and no, and I can tell nobody's there. I go, they left me, they left me, and I'm she I'm shaking like crazy. And I go, I remember what that guy said, you gotta get your sleeping bag while you still can. So I I run, grab my sleeping bag, you know, because I'm exhausted making to this checkpoint. I pushed beyond pushing, you know, I wouldn't do this again, probably. Okay, I pushed so hard so hard into the you know, like the bomb zone, you know. And I uh I went out there and I'm shaking so bad, and I said, I need to get in this sleeping bag. And I finally calmed myself down that I could get the sleeping bag open, got in it, and then I'm hyperventilating in the sleeping bag, right? I'm like, oh my god. I go, I was hyperventilating and I go, and I thought, I go, okay, I quit. So I I so I quit at the 73 mile mark, and I'm like, I'm out there in this parking lot, and I'm out there for a couple hours, you know, and I I hear a voice that goes, Hey Bill, is that out? Is that you out there? It was somebody I've been with earlier in the year in the race. I'm sorry, earlier in the race, and I said, Yeah, this is me. He goes, Well, you want to come soon. Sleep in a warm cabin. I go, no, I really like this ice-covered parking lot. I was like a quarter mile away from where they, it was not the restaurant. It was a cabin that was the checkpoint, but I didn't know it. It was you know very loosely explained to me, or I or I was, you know, didn't get all the details.

SPEAKER_02 44:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:21

And so yeah, I went in there and and yeah, and then I I remember thinking to myself, I go, oh my god, this is a really worthy of opponent. This arrow here is really, really hard. I like stuff that's really, really hard. And even if it tries to kill me, I like it, you know. And so yeah, I've been back in the when the movie was my eighth attempt. The next time I go out there, which hopefully will be next year, it'll be my 13th attempt. Yeah, I never quit, but that thing is hard.

SPEAKER_00 44:52

So at the end of the movie, it says, and that was uh as of twenty twenty four, Bill's planning his 13th attempt. Yes or no? Have you tried it again?

SPEAKER_01 45:03

I think I think she the move, I think when she she updated since that movie was done. So I'm when she put the 13th attempt, that is the right amount. Okay, but when the movie was made, I was on my eighth attempt. So there were some delays on getting out there with the pandemic and all that, you know. Okay, gotcha. All right, so you've done she updated that back section.

SPEAKER_00 45:25

So, yes, I am on my 13th attempt. Okay, and then seventh attempt of Denali. Yeah, I've done six.

SPEAKER_01 45:35

The sixth one I fell in a crevice, also, and I was like, it was terrible. I was hung up on my by my arms, just sitting there, and they were trying to pull me out because it was I went later in the year, so I wouldn't get frostbite. I went not later, but yeah, yeah. It went in June May.

SPEAKER_00 45:52

Ideal time, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 45:53

It's ideal if you're really light, I think, because I weighed you know around 200 pounds, and I was I kept poking through the crevices, and finally one poked through that my arms were sticking out like this, and I'm hanging there, and they're like, they're pulling on me and they're kicking me out. It's like a cork in this thing. Yeah, and I remember I was sitting there and they're I it felt like like a half hour. It was probably like 15 or 20 minutes. They couldn't get me out, and another group came by, and I remember my guy, this they came by these guys, and and she and the guy goes, Do you need my help? And and she goes, No, no, no, we got under control. I go, I'm thinking to myself, I go, your ass, we got under control. I'm sitting here for 15, 20 minutes, and nobody can figure out how to get me out of this thing. And then the the guy just like he he came around and took one look at me, and he he he was, I found out later, he's like a North Face sponsored skier, right? So he was up there skiing Denali, he's extreme. He just like walked right out with his skis, grabbed me by the arm, and popped me out, you know, and freaking and that was it. And I go, Wow, that was great. So he got me right out of there, and I I saw him in Tuscope, Toscobia, right, or whatever up there afterwards, whatever that little town is. Yeah. It's not Tuscopia, but anyway, the little town up there were the climate town. And I said, Why did you come over and pull me out? He says, Because I looked in your eyes and you had panic, Bill. Because I wasn't sure they could get me out. I'd been in there so long. And so he just pulled me out. I go, dude, you're a stud. I bought I'm buying you and your buddy dinner. The least I could do.

SPEAKER_00 47:40

Have you gone back to the Anglish channel?

SPEAKER_01 47:45

I was trying this year for my sixth attempt. I took eight years off and I swam for a year and a half. So yeah, that that year also I hurt my knee on Denali because another crevice, my one leg poked through and one went to the side. So I had no problem with saying, okay, I'm gonna go back to swimming. And so I gave myself a year and a half. I'd got I people had said you swam so much, Bill, that you'll get your fitness back in in like a year if you swim the channel. And I said, Well, I don't know about a year, but I'll give myself like a year and a half. And I wasn't, I went to the bay. I I was up, I got I got three four-hour swims in San Francisco Bay in the in the winter with no wetsuit, you know. Just crazy. Under 60 degrees. Yeah, I was like 58 or something. And I just I couldn't make it. I needed more, I needed another year. But anyway, the bottom line is I burned myself out on swimming because I just was pushing too hard, doing too much for the fitness I was, you know, went all the way through the winter, and and and and then it was like all of a sudden I go, I can't swim for a while. Then all of a sudden, like a year's gone and I haven't swam. I go, Well, I'm on land for a while now. I'll go back to the channel again again when I got like three years to train for it. But yeah, so I I did pretty good, but it was eight years off wasn't enough to get it back in you know, less than a year and a half for me.

SPEAKER_00 49:17

Yeah, you swam San Francisco Bay. That's shark-infested cold water. I I don't know how you did it, but I've I've been there so many times. I go there a lot. I don't know how you did it. I was I was just flabbergasted that you're just doing that as just a regular person, not an Iron Man just or a triathlon. You you just did it, and that's scary. The barges that go into it.

SPEAKER_01 49:42

Yeah, we all were we yeah, they never even thought the sharks came into San Francisco Bay until they started tracking them. Yeah, they started putting trackers on them. Then they found out these great whites are coming into San Francisco Bay. Nope. And then you're like, but there's there had never been never an attack in San Francisco Bay. And so I always feel relatively comfortable there. But I remember one time we swam, and it was right after, I don't know if you ever saw us on the news, but a shark had Great White had jumped up on Alcatraz, literally like almost on the land, and it grabbed a seal and dragged him back into the water. Yeah, and we swam the next day after that. No, thank you. And we were like, We're we're not afraid of sharks, sharks are afraid of us. We're South Enders. That's my club, the South End Club. Woohoo, South End power.

SPEAKER_00 50:36

All right. You have you gone back to have you gone back to Argentina since the movie?

SPEAKER_01 50:44

No, I yeah, oh, I've tried, yeah, maybe one more time. And I yeah, I haven't done as well, man. I didn't my best was that first one. Then you saw the one in the movie, then I tried one more time. I also got altitude sickness up there, but a different kind, you know. It was like I was just I thought I had like a like almost like a flu thing up there, you know. I was so sick. Yeah, you know.

SPEAKER_00 51:08

All right, and then I never quit. I'll go back again. You've done bad water again, unsupported.

SPEAKER_01 51:18

I've tried two or three times. So unsupported, I made it. I I think my record is 17 miles right now, but I need to do a different little different rule. So, what I do is I set my date up like two months in advance, and it has to be like, you know, I do it like how the race does it, you know. So I just set it up for a date. It was in August, and I said, I'm gonna do this solo self-contained. That's when so I'm pulling a two uh my first time I pulled a 250-pound cart with all my survival gear, and I think five or six people have done the solo self-contained, and but it was like all these weather reports were coming that it was gonna be one of the hottest days ever on earth. Yeah, and I'm in Death Valley getting ready to pull this cart unsupported. So you do have a crew there that just keeps an eye on you to make sure you don't die, right? But like in the race, you can get in the car, in the van, cool off as long as the van doesn't move, and then get back out and go. In this, you can't. So I remember I'm out there and I'm pulling this cart, and it was like I felt like I was doing good until that sun came up, and then it kept getting hotter and hotter and hotter. And if I think our our last reading was like 150 degrees or something in the sun, and we're in the sun. Nope. Official temperatures are in the shade, there's no shade. And then I remember my buddy came up to me. I was really in bad shape. He goes, Bill, you just got to make it like another mile, and then there's a place where you could cool off. There's some shade. I go, Oh my god, how great! He says, Yeah, it's not quite what you think. It's a little ditch, but you can sit in that little ditch and your your calves will be in the shade, and it'll feel good because he had tried it before, too. Yeah, and so I got up to that ditch and I sat down. I go, You gotta be kidding me. This is my break from the sun. But that just having your calf in the shade, yeah, was huge, huge. You know, anyway, and then I so I made it out to like I think I made it like 16, 17 miles, and then I just start once you start throwing up, it's like all over, yeah, man. It was like I just yeah, because you can't recover out there, man. There's no way to recover. No, and so I've I've tried it, I think three times. Okay, two or three. My subconscious mind's blocking out probably the last one, but uh crazy, but and and yeah, I've made it, I think, to the first checkpoint is as far as I made it, which was like 17 miles. Okay.

Fear, Identity, And The Real Why

SPEAKER_00 54:00

So, Bill, I just want you to very hard. It's it's epic epic shit, if you don't mind me saying that. Epic. I'm just gonna say epic. And you know, you're saying your motto, show up and suffer, right? Definitely show up and suffer. It's a suffer fest for you. So my question, uh, what does this do? What how does this help? What what are you what are you uh running from or doing this for?

SPEAKER_01 54:35

Maybe running to some people who are positive say you're running to something. Okay. Well, I had to think about it a lot, especially like when I didn't make Aguancog, well, you know, and and went back down. And and I said, well, maybe this message is for people just to try to get their big dream, their big goal. Maybe that's why I was put on this earth. At least get out there and try. Yeah, you know, go out of that comfort zone and try to go after that big goal or dream that maybe you shelved earlier in your life, or maybe you never had the courage to do it. Because I will tell you, when I kept failing Arrowhead, I was so worried that what people would say that I never even counted how many attempts I'd had. You know what I mean? I never even counted how many attempts I had. And then the the the young lady Quinn, who's the director of it, you know, the movie, she goes, Bill, do you know what attempt you're on? I go, No, I don't even know. She goes, You're on number eight. I go, you gotta be kidding me. Because I'd always tell people, go, I don't really know. I don't know, two or three. You know, I just it was just my standard response because I didn't want to act like I was this loser who can't make it, you know, with a million attempts.

SPEAKER_03 55:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 55:48

But then it was like I noticed that I started getting all this respect after the movie came out and all this, like, wow, he doesn't quit. He keeps, yeah, this gets me emotional. He keeps, no matter what happens to him, he goes back and he toes that line, starts that mountain again, goes across that desert with that big cart again, goes into that English channel again. I I I have the courage, I've developed the courage to always go back and try again.

SPEAKER_00 56:17

So, so like I said before this started. I I want to ask why though? Why do why do it? I think when watching the movie, your sister almost said it, but I believe she stopped herself but uh during the interview. But why do what you do? Why why do it? Why do it?

SPEAKER_01 56:37

Why put yourself I think because I was so I was so afraid as a kid. I was afraid of like everything, you know. I just I was just a really afraid kid, and I really wanted to beat this this fear, and so I just won't let fear stop me from anything anymore. You could almost name any event, and I would try it and do the best I could do. You know, I mean the most deadly mountains, whatever. I would try it and do the best I could do, you know, and and that's what I do. So when I hear if something scares me like really bad, I know I need to do it. I go, I have to do that. I have to try and do that because I won't let fear ever stop me again in my life. Uh I like how you said running two.

SPEAKER_00 57:25

So we'll we'll stick to that.

SPEAKER_03 57:27

We'll stick to that though.

SPEAKER_01 57:29

Running two.

SPEAKER_00 57:30

I might be I might be a faster runner if I was running from. We'll we'll go to running two. So lots, lots of traveling. How did you do what you did and and knowing what's to come? I mean, for your multiple attempts. I mean, how did you do that? Like, how did you get your mind prepared while you're on the plane and and and this and that to and from the airport to the the hotel, knowing what's ahead of you? How how did you get your mind right? Like, what did you do? I I know it's show up and tougher, but some other things or things that you've put in your mind to help you guide through, like, dude, this is not going to be easy, tough, it's my fifth attempt. You know, like what do you do for yourself in this time?

SPEAKER_01 58:19

I think one of the things is I I had a mantra. You know, after you get beat, after you don't make it so many times, you you start to lose that confidence, you know, you're losing, I'm losing that confidence, you know. And and I'm trying to, you know, trying to get that I could make it. And and Jesse, my life coach, I remember like I after I didn't make it, you know, like like my third or fourth time or fifth time, whatever it was. And she said, We need to get you a mantra, Bill. And it said, okay, I'm doing the best I can do, and the best I can do is good enough. You know what I mean? Like, I can't go out there and think I gotta finish this or I'm a total freaking loser. That doesn't really work, that doesn't help you. You know, I can't, I if I have I I'll have not made it eight times if I don't make this, you know, and and I just think all I can do is the best I can do, and the best I can do is good enough. And and I've gotten since that movie came out, and I really like and the movie came out and aguankagua that last time, and just embraced that at least I'm in the arena and I'm fighting the fight. And that's what I was put on this earth for people to do to teach them to get in the arena and fight the fight. Yeah, and it's not easy, and I don't even like telling people to do what I do because it's freaking really hard to keep showing back up after you've fallen in a crevice and you're scared shitless because you fell in a crevice, you know. Oh, and you I just all the things that have happened to me like have caused me issues that I gotta re-get out there and and and and get my mind back as strong as I can get it to keep you know going, yeah, and trying again.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:02

So I was reading it somewhere before before this episode, it says turning failures and relentless drive into powerful lessons on resilience. That's that's what you go for, that's what you do. That's that's your mantra, that's your model.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:16

I really I and I've been I'm seeing more people talking about you know beating failure and stuff. And because it was it when I first failed, it was an embarrassment if you failed, you know. I mean, and that's why I didn't tell anybody, and I never counted, you know, and now it's almost like just that you're in the arena, you know, and it was like like the Rocky movie, you know, the original Rocky movie that he was in the arena and he went the distance. You know, that thing left a big impression in me when that first came out in the theater, was huge. And the Rudy, Rudy also is the other movie, you know, the the young guy who couldn't make the you know, the Notre Dame football team or whatever, you know, all that, you know, and he he got in and made one tackle, and he's like a legend for it, you know. And those two movies though were just try, Bill. Just keep trying, just keep trying, just keep trying and learning and try to figure it out. So I'm like, and right now, you know, like I said, I'm trying to get, you know, it's you know, trying to put all my finances back together to make it to Arrowhead. But I'm like, I'm doing a lot of training and I'm much smarter now on figuring it out, you know, and I and what I do is I chunk it down, so you know. It's like, okay, just make it like to the first, you know, first beer in the trail or whatever, the first part in the trail, or first turn off in the trail, or make it to this mile mark, or make it to that. And so you're just chunking it down so you don't have to, you know, think of the whole 135 miles of arrowhead, you know. Okay.

Mantras, Chunking, And Mental Training

SPEAKER_00 1:02:00

Okay. A couple more questions, if that's okay. Just out normal questions.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:05

No, you're doing great. I'm I'm very honored to be on Miles and Mountain podcast. Woo!

SPEAKER_00 1:02:11

Well, thank you. Thank you. You're doing great, Nick.

unknown 1:02:14

Woo!

SPEAKER_00 1:02:14

Well, one one of the things that uh I had to ask is whose idea was to make the movie? The documentary.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:24

So that's kind of funny too, because my sister came to me. She she she asked me, she goes, Bill, what do you think? And her what what do you think about my son and his friends doing a documentary on you? And because her son had just graduated from film school, right? Gotcha. Him and his friends had just graduated from film school. And I go, Wow, that sounds great. It's not like I got a million people knocking down my door. And she goes, Well, what's the first race you got coming up? You know, and and I go, Well, I have arrowhead. And so she like, as the race is leading up, she's looking at the weather. And actually, on that was where there's it was like the you know, what what's that thing called where it's super cold, man? The you know, where the super cold hits, you know, it's called what's that called, Austin, where the super cold. Yeah, it was, you know, the aware. Anyway, it's called something, you know. Cold front? Yeah, it was a once-in-a-century thing, you know. Yeah, I mean, it was a big cold record-setting cold front. Okay, and like the coldest temperatures has been like forever. And so it was all over the news, everything. And my sister calls me and she goes, You need to get him getting those kids to somebody to drive them around who knows what they're doing, right? Because if you go on the side road trying to get to the snowmobile trail and you break down and you don't know what you're doing, yeah, you can easily die out of there. People die in their cars where the cars run out of gas and stuff. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. They run their heater till they run out of gas and then they die, you know. And so, yeah, I I found a guy who's a local there to take these kids around, and and he loved it. He'd been there his whole life, super experienced in the cold. And so I'd pull up at like where there's some crossroad, you know, because we would there's there's a handful of crossroads where they could get out to where the snow the snowmobile trail is that we're on, you know, pulling our carts. Yeah. And he's like, these kids were all dressed in black, they all had the same outfits. They look like ninjas running out there filming me and stuff. And I think they all had a great experience. I think it was great for them, it was great for me. I loved it, and I I only made it, it was the lowest I'd ever made it. I only made it to the first checkpoint. At the time, it was the lowest I'd ever done, and and I was all upset. And but it was like they, you know what I mean? People it people loved it. I gave it everything I had, that was all I could do. Oh, yeah, let me get it. It's a polar vortex, that's what it was. All right, the polar vortex is rolling through, so it's gonna be record cold everywhere. And we were in International Falls, Minnesota, the coldest spot.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:16

Yeah, that Midwest hits different. You love the cold, the cold hits different in Midwest. Oh my god, to the bone, to the bone.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:24

Oh, yeah, it's cold. I said I because when I got a cold in Alaska, it's not like it's a drier cold. Yeah, yeah, because I said this is where cold to the bone was invented, man. It was in in northern Minnesota, and people live there, I'm sure in Canada too. People live there, people live there, but so yeah, you know what my buddy told me, my buddy who lives there, he said, you know why the Russians are so tough? Because they live in the same conditions as International Falls. Yeah, I go, no kidding, because I stayed in the hotel the one year for six weeks because I wanted to get used to the cold. I didn't. I like all I did was lock myself in my hotel room, miss Christmas, all this stuff, got serious issues, and you know, I tried to get used to the cold, but it was so cold, it's unbelievable. And my buddy who lives there, who lives on the land, so he has a wood-burning stove. I would tell him how tough it is being in the hotel, you know, and I'm like, there's only like me in the hotel at the time, yeah, because nobody's there in the winter, maybe one other person sometimes. And he goes, Bill, you think it's bad for you? I have to get up two hours before you go out, cut snow after a snowstorm, shovel snow, and do all this just to keep his wife alive. So he's got to shovel, cut wood, put it in the wood-burning stove. And he goes, We don't even think about it out here. You just do it, do it to survive. Yes, there it's another level of toughness than somebody who shows up for six weeks, yeah, living out there.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:58

So, Bill, when when Epic Bill came around doing these adventures and stuff, how old were you? When did you start? I know you started running at thir at 30, but when did the adventures start? How old were you? And how old are you now? If you don't mind me asking, yeah, I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:18

If you don't mind me lying, it's okay. But I I brainwash my brain all the time that I'm 30 years old. I never let me anybody tell me anything different. It's like what you put in your brain, so I just keep telling myself I'm 30, I'm 30, because when I played the ball sports and all those things, it seemed like the peak of those sports were people who were always around 30 years old. And I just believe how tough mentally you could make yourself. For me, it's saying I'm 30 and not, you know, there's so much crap about age and what it does to you. And I don't believe 99% of it. You know what I mean? I think a lot of it is you just quit being active, you quit doing this, you you know, you just it's stay active, keep fighting the fight, keep staying out there, and uh, and and don't give up on your dreams, and and you know what I mean, and and and and you live a good life, you know. Okay. So I say 30. I say it. I'll tell you a funny one. I was on okay, real quick, I gotta tell you this story because it's kind of funny. So I show up on Aguincago and they have checkpoints. Like as you go up the mountain, we have to pass a physical, right? Like uh, they check your blood, and I forget what they do, but anyway, they check your your breathing and your oxygen, and you got to go through these checkpoints. And I go to the first checkpoint, and a guy comes out, and uh, you know, our whole team goes at Aguancago because they got these camps, and a guy comes out in his white doctor-looking coat, and he goes, he's got his little clipboard, and he looks at me and he goes, Okay, what's your age? I go, I'm 30. Okay, and he looks at me, and I know, like, right, there is no way anybody has their IDs up there, right? Nobody has their IDs up on Agua and Cagua carrying them. Yeah, and I said, I'm 30. He goes, No, this is real, Bill. I go, I'm 30. I've had a lot of sun in my life, but I'm 30. I'm 30. And I said it like three times. The guy, he finally wrote it down. He just wrote 30 down, and then he and I and I passed all my stuff, so he let me go. And here's the funny part, right? So there's one more checkpoint. I think it's at like 17,000 feet, and we've been doing, you know, we stop at camps to acclimate for a day or two, and you keep as you move up the mountain, and so I go to the the 17,000 camp or whatever it is, same doctor walks out. He was relieving somebody up there, and he takes he's got his little paper and pad, and he goes, Okay, 30 years old.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:04

That's funny, that's funny.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:06

That is funny. So I'm 30.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:09

Yeah, you're 30. We're sticking up.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:11

Up here, up here, up here.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:14

Love it, love it, love the humor. All right.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:18

Since you No, it's actually brainwashing

The 30-Year-Old Mindset

SPEAKER_01 1:10:20

too. I'm brainwashing myself.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:23

Since you own your own rental stores and everything else, movie rental stores, and and a huge movie buff, your number one all-time favorite movie. What is it?

SPEAKER_01 1:10:38

It was probably Rudy. Rudy. I remember my kid, my son was like eight years old or seven when that came out. I just love that he didn't quit. I love that he didn't quit. I loved it, I loved it. Yeah, that ended up and uh quite emotional too. And like I said, it was just a big deal to me. Okay, yeah, he got carried off the field and all that, and you know, anyway, I loved it. I loved it. And I watched, I probably watched it 16 times in VHS form. Oh, yeah, and I've watched it a lot. I've watched, you know, I'm I've just watched the main scenes now. I pretty much burned myself out on it, but I loved it, and I also loved Rocky because I saw Rocky, you know, a long time ago, and I just loved it. He didn't quit, you know. It's that not quitting thing, no matter what obstacles are showing, you just don't quit. And Rocky showed, you know, he didn't win, and he was, you know, and but he was perseverance. He was a hero to a lot of people, and you know, he didn't win, you know. Yeah, perseverance. I'm so that's what I'm good at is perseverance. That's what people respect. You can't knock me out easy. You can't even knock me out out of 12 times on on at Arrowhead and six times on Denali. And I love it, you know.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:54

I love it, I love it, Bill. All right, thank you, man. What book inspired you, or what's your number number one book that inspired you? Period.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:04

I don't read as much as I should anymore, but actually back in the day, I was more of a guy who read money books because I was all into money when I was a kid, you know, it was a big deal to me. That's why I started. I mean, I started the video stores because I got a passion for it, but I did want to make money too, and you know, and I wanted to be a millionaire and all this stuff, and so I remember, you know, I was reading like people were billionaires back then. I read their autobiographies, you know. Anybody who was a billionaire back then, I read their autobiographies. Okay, and that's really where I learned about money, and I did become a with credit cards starting at 23. By the time I was 28, I wasn't a millionaire. So I you know, I did just by self-made man. Read their books, you start feeling what these guys feel. Self-made man with credit cards.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:57

There you go. There you go.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:59

All right. You've done a lot of traveling and everything else. What was your go-to snack at home and traveling? Your snack.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:11

Wow. I'm trying not to snack like I used to. I do bars, I do protein bars. Okay, you know, what's the one I'm doing now for the bars?

SPEAKER_00 1:13:20

The uh I don't know which I do a different one.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:25

Anyway, yeah, I got I I do them and they're I mean, they're you know what I mean. None of that stuff is super good for you, but I use it as a snack. You know, I'm single, I just want something quick, fast, you know. You know, I'm eating, I I go through stages where I'm super healthy for periods of time, and I go through stages where I don't.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:47

Hey, that's all of us. If uh if somebody says otherwise, they're lying to you.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:51

So but I will I will when I'm going good, I will have banana with like some peanut butter on it. So that's like a good go-to snack.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:58

Oh heck yeah. Anything peanut butter is good, and especially my book. Yeah, I agree. So, do you all right? I gotta ask you my staple question, then, if that's okay. Do you do you eat pin peanut butter jelly sandwiches?

SPEAKER_01 1:14:14

I do not. You know why my mom used to make those for me when I was in grammar school. When I was in grammar school, I like them. I would, I would, I've eaten them on the trail. Okay, but my mom made them peanut butter and jelly and like almost every day. And I'd always look what the other kids were eating, and they'd have something with meat in it. And I would I got like envy of something with meat and cheese. And so I think when I was like at the end of my bring-in-to-lunch career, I got like a bologna sandwich with cheese, and I was in heaven, but but but yeah, I think it was more like I felt like man, everybody else has better looking sandwiches than me. I have the peanut butter and jelly, totally understand. I still eat I've eaten a lot of that on the trail, a lot of that on the trail, peanut butter and jelly, peanut butter and uh honey on the trail.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:03

It's it's actually real good for my stomach. When out on adventures, what's the one piece of gear you bring? Always, whether it's hot, cold, what's the one piece? Not your wallet, what's the one piece of gear that you bring that you live by? This is just a just a like going out for the day for the day or when you're traveling doing these adventures. What's the one thing that you bring?

SPEAKER_01 1:15:34

Yeah, we all talk about what's the main thing you need, and whether it's uh you know, people will say it's like some people say it's like a coat, and other people would say it's fire. You know what I mean? Like if you could start a fire, you want a lighter and you want to start a fire because if you can keep moving, you don't need real thick coats, you know, or a sleeping bag. If you can keep moving, you don't need a sleeping bag. Yeah. I because I am not as good of a survival as those guys, I would say if I'm when I'm an

What’s Next And Final Advice

SPEAKER_01 1:16:10

arrowhead, it's my sleeping bag for sure. Okay. So because that's your that's your that's your last ditch save you thing if you start getting really cold. Around here, I don't do anything.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:24

Gotcha, gotcha. What's what's next, Bill? What is next for you?

SPEAKER_01 1:16:30

Well, I'm trying like I said, I kind of hurt my knee, then I took off for swimming. So I've been running now for a little bit a while. I started running again, and you know, I'm not in real good shape. I'm I had a lot, I had weight on from attempting that English channel attempt. I didn't even get to it, the qualifier in San Francisco Bay. And so I'm starting to drop weight, I'm starting to run again. I've been working hard on healing my knee from where I stepped in the crevice and and twisted it. And so next I'm gonna do a 12-hour last man standing. Nice. It's have you heard of the last? I love those last man standing. That concept of it is just it fires me up. I don't know if I do too, man. And it's like I do I watched, I watched the one in the one in Texas they just had, you know, whatever the name of that is. But anyway, I loved it. And they go, you go 4.2 miles, and it's the you go till there's nobody left. So you gotta go 4.2 miles in an hour. A backyard ultra. And if you get there early, you can take a break. Yeah, backyard ultra. And it's the the Texas one, yeah, the running group. Anyway, I love that.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:47

They're all over the place, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:49

And yeah, I know now it's really crazy, but yeah, and then and then and then you and then however long you get there ahead of time, you get to rest, and then you go again on the hour. And the one in Texas, they were there, it started raining, they had this really thick, goopy mud on their shoes. Oh yeah. I mean, the the the that adobe stuff. My my son, I my my son lives near where the race was, near Austin, Texas. Yeah, BPN. It's BPN's race. I loved it. And and he's a Nick Bear's a big, he's just a good fan of endurance stuff. So, but anyway, so so they're out there, they got the mud caked on their feet. They've got like five extra pounds probably on their shoes, whatever that stuff weighs, and they're and they're still going around, and I just loved it. And you know, and they went, they the the top guys, they didn't go as far as they would in one in great conditions, but they still went out for like a couple days. But I was like, man, I'm not in that good of shape right now, but I want to experience it. And sometimes you like going out, you toe the line, even though you know you can't make it, you get your ass kicked because it fires you up to do it again. You look you're I'm gonna learn about the race. If I could make 12 miles, 12 hours, I'd be super ecstatic. If I can make a marathon, I'd be super ecstatic. Oh, yeah. Because I really hurt hurt myself pretty good, you know. So, but now I'm I'm coming back. Let's go, done with the swimming, locked in on the running, freaking last man standing, 12 hours. That's what I'm shooting for. And if I don't make it, you know I'm coming back the next year.

SPEAKER_00 1:19:23

Let's have that Rudy moment, the Rocky moment, you know. Let's go. What's your end goal, Bill? What's your end goal? Everything said and done. What's your end goal?

SPEAKER_01 1:19:34

Well, you know, I'm gonna retire, it's gonna be just like the corona commercial where they sit up there in a hammock and they click their beers together. And I I saw that commercial and I go, that is my worst nightmare.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:52

That's fine.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:53

I got you. I am gonna fight the fight right till the freaking end. And when they won't let me in things, I'll be making up my own things because I never stop fighting a fight. I gotcha. I love it, I love the fight.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:06

Okay, follow-up question, and then one more question at the end. All right, just one more. Well, two more, but all right, follow-up on that one. What do you want to be remembered as? I appreciate that. With everybody, everybody who's interviewed you, including CNN, that's a compliment. So I appreciate you, Bill, for saying that. Okay, what do you want to be remembered as and by?

SPEAKER_01 1:20:36

I think the guy wouldn't quit. All right, no matter what the event was, he would take it on and then he would go after it over and over again, and he wouldn't quit until he made it. He would do it until he made it, and then I might have got in somewhere or died. But I'm gonna keep showing up, man. And as long as they'll let me in, these races, I'll do it. Or and what I said in Arrowhead was if Ken won't let me in, I'll freaking do it the weekend before. I'll go do weekend the air, and Ken's the race director, and he's great. I'm sure he'll let me in till till I fucking can't go any further than the start line. Gotcha, gotcha.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:19

Okay, will there be a sequel or a book in the future?

SPEAKER_01 1:21:28

We are gonna do a book for sure. Everybody's putting books out now. We're gonna do a book for sure. We are, I want to have a sequel, I want to have part two to my life story, right? I got a lot, I got Everest on my goal list. I gotta finish Aguancagua, I gotta finish Arrowhead, I got stuff I gotta finish. I gotta swim the English Channel still. I need a part two where I start hitting the shore, you know. I need that start hitting the shore.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:56

I I had that oomph, but I need to know more, all right. That's why I said that's why I asked if you were gonna get a sequel. But a book will do great. A book. You get that book, I'll be the first one.

SPEAKER_01 1:22:06

Yeah, we're gonna do a book for sure. Do you see the uh you see the wall behind me? So I'm always putting, I'm always brainwashing myself, just so you know. I was gonna bring up I always have, yeah. And I and yeah, yeah, and we have a course right now that's out, it's for endurance runners, you know, how to not quit. And so we just we put that out. That's on that. You can find that on my Instagram or you know, and on my bio. Yeah. So we're doing that. I'm trying to put courses out so I can more for the mental end of the game, yeah. But letting people know how to strengthen their mind, what I do to strengthen my mind, and you know, and there's you know, there's not, I don't believe in the tricks, you know. I mean, I do I do do tricks when I'm out there, but you eventually just keep doing things until you're so mentally tough, you're just gonna do it until you can't go any further.

SPEAKER_03 1:22:57

I gotcha, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:22:58

But but I do work hard on building my confidence here with my wall and stuff. See that wall? I look at that for a couple hours every morning.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:05

When did you build that, anyways? When did you start that wall? I mean, because you you discuss it a little bit and in the documentary, but I mean, it it looks like it's grown.

SPEAKER_01 1:23:16

It's I mean, I I could if you can I can I twist him a little bit or will it screw it all up? No, yeah, you're anyway. It goes down, it's a whole it's a whole wall, and then part of the next wall and part of the next wall. That's crazy because it started what because because remember Arnold in his if you ever watch his documentary and know about Arnold Schwarzenegger, he started out, he had a picture of the bodybuilders on his wall that he idolized, you know, and he wanted to be like these bottle bodybuilders. So my wall is full of because I've done this before and lost perception, but if you you know, this way and that way, it's full of people I respect, people affirmations that I've that I'm that I believe in, that I keep put saying to myself. So I'll sit there and I'll look at it, I'll repeat the affirmations for 10 to 15, 20 minutes in the morning, and then I'm just looking at it too, just all all day long. And I figure that's going to my subconscious mind, you know, like a like a billboard, you know, like they put the damn billboards up. Who wants to buy what's on that billboard? But they think if they keep showing it to you, you're gonna eventually get that in your subconscious mind and buy it, you know, do it. Yeah, that 30 years old's up there, man. I probably could pass a lie detector test on the 30, maybe. Yeah, so I so I constantly look at that wall and I keep adding to it, you know. And then if I find out something negative of somebody who's like one of my, you know, like a hero or somebody I look up to that I want to, you know, go, you know, kind of do the same thing or be like them. If I find out something negative about them, they come off the wall. You gotta be real special to make it on that wall.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:58

Yeah, and it it seems like there's nothing like you know, Cole Hawk Hawker and then Freddie Mercury right there.

SPEAKER_01 1:25:05

Yeah, he's up there, Cole Hawker's up there. Yeah, he's up there because I don't know, man, he won the gold medal. And some I do put up for a little while because they're hot at the moment, you know. But if they if if in four years Cole Hawker hasn't done more, then he might drop off the wall, you know. You gotta stay you gotta be either be super, super huge to me, or you gotta stay relative relevant. You know what I mean? You gotta stay relevant. I I can't look up at you last time he, you know, he won a gold medal, which got him on the wall, but now he has to keep going, and you know, he's gotta go after that world record they just set in the mile, right? Destroyed it, current destroyed it. We always keep we keep I know we keep attacking, we keep attacking to be on the wall.

SPEAKER_00 1:25:55

We keep attacking, and that's what you do, Bill. You you attack it, you should be on that wall. You know, you're saying your motto Oh, I am on the wall. I'm on your your your mindset. I'm all over the wall. Your mindset show up and suffer, turning failures and relentless drive into per uh powerful lessons of resilience. It it it says a lot, Bill. And you know what? With you your nephew inviting me to interview you. I've I've yeah, it this is one in a lifetime interview for me. I I appreciate it, you know. I I really do. It's uh this is like the pinnacle of my podcast interview world, uh believe it or not. And I appreciate you having faith and trust in me and and everything else. So we're we're pretty much done, Bill. Would there or is there anything you would like to say that it did not mention or you know, say as we go, as we leave?

SPEAKER_01 1:26:58

Yeah, I I I I think the main thing I just want to reiterate it, you know, and is that you know, no matter what's going on in your life, whatever low, whatever you're in, keep freaking fighting. There's always a solution to get out of it. Always a solution, always keep fighting, there's always a solution and stay positive. The one thing I try and do from my wall is I try not to walk out of this room with a negative attitude to walk into life. I want to be the guy that motivates people when I walk around. I don't try and leave my apartment with a negative attitude. I'm gonna do whatever it takes to snap me back into a positive attitude before I leave here so I can put that positive attitude out into the world.

SPEAKER_00 1:27:45

Well, epic Bill. I appreciate you, man. Seriously. And and if when if and when people start, you know, the listeners start watching your documentary, they're gonna know who I just interviewed, and they're gonna be like, Oh my gosh, I cannot believe Nick interviewed this guy.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:01

So oh, you're great, you're great, Nick.

SPEAKER_00 1:28:03

You're great, Nick. You're great, you're fantastic. You're trying to help people. I love that. I I do appreciate you, Bill. And before we go, I mean, I know I'm on on air, but before we go, can I get a picture of you, please? Is it okay? All right, just just because yeah, you need me to do anything. Nope. Just or you can do thumbs up or whatever. So one. I do this one. There you go. Let's do that. Let's do that. Ready? One, two, there you go. Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:36

You're the king, Nick. Bill, if you ever want to talk outside of this podcast, too, just let me know. That that that'd be awesome.

SPEAKER_00 1:28:43

Radio's next on your list. What's that?

SPEAKER_01 1:28:45

Rodeo power. Rodeo power. Rodeo power, too, man. Gotcha, gotcha. Tell those guys when you interview the next one of them that I got a lot of respect for them, man. All right.

SPEAKER_00 1:28:56

That's a really tough sport. We'll do. So until next time.